The White Council

Re: Tom & Goldberry

Tolkien and Inklings Discussion

: : I wondered if I would get a bite! Including a line about Tom & Goldberry being Aule and Yavanna into the recent "Maiar of Middle-earth" thread.

: : The idea is Eugene Hargrove's (see the URL below).

: : Let me be firm. We will never know who Tom & Goldberry were. Tolkien did not know himself.

: : But, of all the various theories, I think that Eugene's is the most plausable. After all, who but one of the great ones of the Valar could have put the One Ring on and laughed about it (given that Tolkien deliberately rejected the suggestion that Tom was Iluvatar).

: : I know Tolkien tried to explain it in terms of Tom "taking a vow of poverty," and being a creature that had renounced control and thus could not himself be controlled, not even by the One Ring (see Letter #144). But consider, Olorin the Maia took a "vow of poverty" when he came to Middle-earth as Gandalf the Grey. He renounced control, and unlike his brother Curumo the Maia, never attempted to establish dominion in Middle-earth. But he was afraid to even touch the Ring, and would never have put it on.

: : I don't think I actually believe Tom was Aule, but I do think that that theory explains more than any other I have come across.

: I still disagree with the Aule/Yavanna theory. Why would Aule be such a "master of wood, water, and hill", and there is no mention of Tom pursuing smithcraft, or befriending Dwarves. Also Yavanna could not be the "daughter of the River". the river's mother maybe, but not it's daughter. Aule also seems much more practical than Tom, who does not worry about wars, towers, and rings. Not to mention the point made about the Valar remaining in Valinor except Ulmo (who doesn't sound like Tom either). : I the best theories I have come up with are either : #1. Tom and Golberry are both Mair. Tom, one of the Mair of either Aule or Yavanna, and Goldberry one of the Mair of Yavanna or Ulmo. : #2. Tom is a manifestation of the earth itself. This would explain many comments made during the Council such as "such power is not in him unless it is in the earth itself", and his name of Eldest. : or : #3. None of the above, a purposeful enigma (Actually this is the correct answer, but it is no fun, so we argue about what explanation is second best).

Click on the following link for my personal favorite theory (which I don't REALLY believe, btw)...

P.S. I hope this works!