The White Council

Re: Mallorns

Tolkien and Inklings Discussion

I do not think winter actually came to Lorien in the literal sense while the Ring was there so maybe the leaves did fall in the winter but while Lorien was under the power of the Ring it seemed like spring.

TreeBeard.........

: : : : Hmm, why do we think the trees need rings or magic to survive? Maybe they naturally live very long lives. The Mallorn in the Shire grew without any Rings, just the magic dust which may have been just a nutrient/growth aid. The trees were still there long after Galadriel left.

: The Elves of Lorien would not have sailed to the West if Lorien still remain intact, it was their home and one important factor was the mallorns. After Nenya's failing, the mallorns started to fade( to die) which was shown by the falling leaves in winter( with Nenya, old mallorn leaves would fall in spring at the same time new leaves would spout forth.) Without Nenya, time was a taking a toll on the mallorns. If it couldn't grow anywhere then it needed some support of some sort. Galadriel's ring may have extended the mallorns beyond their life span. The trees' life may have been the equivalent of adulthood. Without Nenya, the life of the mallorns was subject to standard time flow which put the tree into its late adulthood. : The mallorn in the shire was still in its infancy in comparison to Lorien. The magic dust may have been a nutrient/growth aid but I find it unlikely considering they used a grain of the dust which tell me that there is magic involved. : I don't think we were saying that the mallorns required a Ring to start off because Galadriel had the mallorns long before she started using Nenya. All I'm saying is that she extended the life span of the mallorns in Lorien.

: Mind's I

: : : : TreeBeard......

: : : : : : : It is curious, because it seems likely that Nenya had something to do with the thriving of the mallorns in Lorien/Laurenlindorinan. The mallorns originally were a gift of the Numenoreans (for mallorns throve even more in ancient Numenor) to Gil-galad during the second age, but the trees did not take root in Lindon, according to Unfinished Tales. So the seeds were passed on to Galadriel, who planted them successfully in Lorien. The only mallorn ever found outside Lorien, of course, was the new Party Tree by Bag End, by virtue of Galadriel's "magic dust."

: : : : : Oberon

: : : : Follow Up: Now that I think about it, Ta Aldarion gave the mallorns to Gil-galad ca. 900-1000 Second Age, and presumably Galadriel received them shortly thereafter. Galadriel did not receive the ring Nenya until Sauron forged the one ring in the late 17th century. Furthermore, the First Council decided to hide the rings and not use them so long as Sauron wielded the One Ring. So likely she did not use the ring until the beginning of the Third Age.

: : : I think Nenya may have extended the life span of the mallorn, so when Nenya's power fail, the mallorns were already beyond it's life span. Although I'm don't understand why they didn't just replant considering that she had the "magic dust", which help the mallorn in the Shire

: : : : So Galadriel may have used other magic to help the mallorns along.

: : : Galadriel had other devices of magic like the elessar which could have help sustain the mallorns prior to Nenya.

: : : Mind's I

: : :