The White Council

Okay, Bilbo had been away from the Ring for a while and that did seem to have a positive effect on him. Instead of seeming fifty, by then he may have resumed normal aging (or partially normal aging) and perhaps now seemed older.

Nonetheless, he is pretty sharp during the Council of Elrond and the discussions afterward. I don't believe his comment about not being able to keep track of days in Rivendell should be regarded as a clear sign of the onset of senility.

I'll meet you halfway, if you will, and agree that -- in the absence of additional evidence either way -- the passage is a bit ambiguous.

: 2) I'm not saying Narya prevented Gandalf from dying, I'm : saying it may have helped him keep going on long journeys, bear : the burdens he had, etc. I realize Gandalf wouldn't "die" : unless something happened like in Moria. Because the one of the : purposes of the Ring is to heal, and we don't see Gandalf use : it to heal others (except maybe Theoden), so it is possible it : was aiding him.

Okay, I think I understand you better. As far as this goes, I can pretty much agree with you. There are passages, however, where I believe we see Gandalf utilizing Narya, though Tolkien obviously doesn't say, "And using the power of Narya...." For example, in Minas Tirith when Gandalf and Prince Imrahil toured the defenses Men were hearted by their presence.

I don't know if he would have regarded using the Ring on himself as a selfish purpose (and therefore unworthy), but perhaps simply being its keeper would have negated any requirement that he actually USE it on itself. As it continually worked to slow Time, it might have continually worked to help him. Perhaps Narya in some small way helped Gandalf resist the lure of the One Ring (that would be an interesting paradox), or simply to stay faithful to his purpose through all those long and disheartening centuries.

: 3) As for this whole debate, I don't think there is conclusive : evidence to without a doubt prove either one of our arguements. : I say that just because someone doesn't "remember something" : doesn't mean it didn't happen. Remember it was a very traumatic : time for all of them. Gandalf had "died", Aragorn was forced to : make the toughest of decisions, and rest of them just seemed : enamored with Lórien. Either way, I don't think one is : definetely wrong or definetly right.

If only the proper wording from Tolkien, such as a narrative comment like "And indeed Time had been slowed in Lorien, as the Fellowship later confirmed when researching matters of the Ring", then you'll never be convinced. I cannot produce such evidence.