The White Council

Re: Was Elrond being arrogant?

Tolkien and Inklings Discussion

: : For some reason, my response of yesterday doesn't seem to have made it on here. I'll try again :)

: : : You response was well put. When I mentioned the politics involved. it wasn't just the wishes of Elrond I was thinking of. Arwen of course really did love Aragorn. And she was a princess of high lineage, higher than Aragorn's. But as much as she may have loved Aragorn, she must also have loved her people and was bound by duty to marry only some one worthy of her. If Aragorn had failed, they would still love each other I'm sure, but her love of her people, her "high" lineage and her duty would have left he no choice but to refuse a marriage.

: : Very true, Arwen did love her people and she knew her duty concerning them. But, was she doing her duty when she chose to stay and become "human"? I think she made her choice on her love of Aragorn (my romantic opinion). I also think it's a moot point (in a way) because if Aragorn had failed, he would have been dead. He was the kind of man who would give his life for his people. It is good to discuss the "what if's" tho :)

: : : As an aside I was thinking earlier about a post I was reading on another board where some one wrote that Arwen did as her father wanted (she didn't elope with Aragorn, but waited patiently etc.) What struck me as funny was that we're talking about a 2,000 year old woman like she was a 16 year old school girl. So I suspect that at that age Arwen could do as she pleased, but she also had her duty to her people. So old and still living at home...I had to get out and get a job when I was 18. :)

: : Most women of that time had to remain at home to protect their reputation. They could only leave home if they became married or if they were declared "past the marriageable age". Even then, they usually went places with another woman in attendence. : : I hadn't realized Arwen was 2,000 years old, I always thought of her between 500 and 1,000 years old. She probably wasn't considered "on the shelf" until closer to 3,000 or 4,000 years old :) How old was Aragorn? : : Men have always been allowed more freedom. From what little I know of early life, boys were considered men by the age of 16, altho in the aristocratic society, it may have been postponed to 18 or 20 because of all the schooling they had to take. : : You waited till you were 18 to get a job? *chuckles* My 15 and 17 yo sons have part-time jobs on the weekends now. I won't be pushing them out of the house when they are 18 but I will expect other responsibilties from them :) Every parent is different :) Makes life interesting at times :)

: : Take care :) I have enjoyed this discussion :)

: : Gynger

: Aragorn was 20 when he first met Arwen. Evidently she looked younger than 20. As for Arwen's actual age, I should really look it up. Two Thousand years old was a guess.

Was he not merely 18?? BTW I got a job working in my father's carpentry business after school when I was 11- 18 years ago. ;-) gotya Neithan Turambar