The White Council

Re: How is Tolkien applicable to your life?

Tolkien and Inklings Discussion

: : : : Now I don't mean this to get too personal, but how does Tolkien apply to your life? We all know Tolkien's aversion to allegory, and how he favored stories that allowed readers to draw their own conclusions and lessons. : : : Which lessons have you drawn?

: : Well, there are highly practical lessons, such as "Shortcuts make long delays..." :-)

And taverns make longer ones!

: : Then there are more significant concepts to chew on. For example, my position on the death penalty has changed over the years. When I was young I was ardently opposed -- I had much more faith in humanity than I do now, I suppose. After having lived awhile, my opinion changed. But through it all, whether in the passion of my youthful ideals or the sobriety of my middle aged concessions, one phrase which came into my mind over and over and over again, was the words of Gandalf to Frodo regarding Gollum (From memory, please excuse any slight inaccuracies):

: : ***** : : Frodo: It was a pity Bilbo didn't kill him while he had the chance.

: : Gandalf: Pity? It was pity that stayed his hand. Pity, and mercy, not to kill without need.

: : Frodo: But he deserved death!

: : Gandalf: Yes. And some who die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be so quick to meet out death. : : ******

That is something that first made me think of capital punishment. (From talking to others, apparently many readers had that raction.) Growing up in a very conservative household, this was probably the first ever quasi-anti-death penalty sentiment I had ever come across. Since then, I have found out much, much more about the death penalty, and oppose it on all concievable grounds. And whenever I reread these lines, I get a warm, fuzzy feeling.

: : Finally, there are what I call the deep structures. These are the patterns of existence that we first learn in story, then become more effecient in recognizing in life, and then finally cultivate the ability to include them in our intuitive decisions. I am speaking of such things as the paradoxical irony that what is small and meek will often bring down the mighty. Or that one must go into the darkness to bring back the treasure. Or that evil will bend over backward to find and destroy that which can do the most good -- whoa that's one I've really held onto over the summer, because of a serious betrayal I had to deal with last spring, and my doubts about whether I want to stay in teaching, when I seem highly inclined to auto destruct in response instead of fighting back and staying the course...

Always fight back. If there is one overarching theme I've found in Tolkien, it's that "evil" is always surmountable, that while the enemy may indeed be powerful, the rumor of its invincibility is due mostly to lies and fear. Just find out who else will fight back with you. (Remember your namesake; she summoned the White Council because the enemies of the Enemy could only hope to triumph in their unity.)

: : Oddly, this discussion brings up my choice for my alias: Galadriel, the oracle of the mirror. I have what I describe to skeptics as envisionings and to believers as visions. Not things I see with my eyes, but powerful, extremely vivid, and very often accurate imaginings. They can be of things past, present or future. Those of you that are familiar with the Meyers Briggs Temperament Inventory will understand what I mean when I identify myself as an Idealist (aka iNtuitive Feeling temperament) subtype Mentor/Counselor (aka INFJ). But I prefer to call my visions "iNtuitings" and I certainly don't claim to be psychic. First of all, "psychic" smacks of those con artist phone lines, and I want to distance myself from those lowlifes as much as possible. But also because if someone were truly psychic, their visions would always be accurate, and quite frankly, I make mistakes. More to the point, my visions work almost identical to the description of Galadriel's mirror: sometimes the things I see come true, sometimes by avoiding them I cause them to happen, sometimes by pursuing them I stop them from happening, and sometimes they just simply and inexplicably don't happen. Having been raised from birth by skeptical parents in a highly skeptical culture, I had been taught NOT to trust my "feelings" or "instincts" or "intuition." This was extremely invalidating and harmful to my psyche. Reading of Galadriel's mirror gave me something back: the right to intuit without the necessity of always being correct, the confidence and the courage to develop my gift rather than to cripple it, the freedom to be who I was and am. I can't think of a better gift.

: : Blessings,

: : Galadriel

: First, Dave, don't feel you can't give your political views here, *provided it relates to Tolkien*. The responses you saw to your post were because it is easy with that sort of discussion to slip totally away from Tolkien. I like reasoned political debate, but my response to your political ideas were off-Tolkien-topic, so I emailed you instead of posting to The White Council (looking forward to your reply!). If you stray too far from Tolkien, fear not, Michael will let you know in a respectful way. That's why this board is so valuable (Thanks Michael!).

Working on that reply. But I'm actually giving a talk on women's liberation this week, so I've been quite busy. Maybe this weekend.

: As to the main topic: 'How is Tolkien applicable to your life.' I read the Hobbit in early high school and LotR sometime in the following couple of years (15+ years ago). My imagination was starved for something that good. It has certainly affected my tastes in literature, stories, and music.

Ditto.

: I've expressed similar things here before. The *best* literature or any other form of art spurs you to virtue. Tolkien certainly succeeds in that for me. Beautifully modeled in The Hobbit and Lord of the Rings are awesome models of compassion (Galadriel's point above about sparing Gollum); self sacrifice (Frodo's choice of bearing the ring); faithfulness (Sam's choice to follow him); justice tempered with mercy (Aragorn's judgement of the Gondor guard who killed trying to save Faramir). I've read good fantasy in other places - the worlds created were fantastic & spurred imagination. Tolkien did that but also modeled nobility in a way that makes me say, "I will be more like Frodo."

: A couple things you wrote, Galadriel, struck a chord with me. I am in favor of the death penalty, but only with great reservation. I haven't heard many other voices that expressed similar ideas about it (if I understood you right). I think the death penalty should only be used with an attitude of compassion for both the victims and the condemned. Most people would blanch at the idea of executing someone while having compassion for them. I find it no contradiction. Sorry if this is too off-topic, but the Gandalf - Frodo exchange about Gollum is critical here. Hope this doesn't start a firestorm.

Is there ever an instance in Tolkien where compassion and a death sentence is given at the same time? Doesn't compassion in Tolkien mean giving someone a second chance (which the death penalty denies)? Aragorn's compassion wouldn't really have meant much if he had Beregond executed anyway, would it? And if Gandalf or Bilbo or the elves had killed Gollum (even if they did it with compassion), what would have happened to Frodo and the Ring and everyone else? Even the wise cannot see all ends...;)

: The second thing is that according to Myers-Briggs, I'm an INTJ or INTP (one answer swung the score the two times I took it). I can no longer remember what all the letters mean, however, the humerous 'prayer' for my personality type is, "LORD, help me to consider others' ideas, WRONG THOUGH THEY BE!" I hope that doesn't come out too strong in how I express my beliefs here.

: Cheers, : -Steve S.