The White Council

Re: magic, the supernatural, religion and Tolkien

Tolkien and Inklings Discussion

: The magic thread has really generated an interesting discussion. : As has been noted, it has branched into a number of sub-threads and is being squeezed off the bottom of the board. : May I re-launch this particular aspect of the thread:

: Is magic just a literary device, or is it applicable (oh I hate that word, does anyone have a better one?) to the world?

: How far are magic/religion/the supernatural/science redeemable with one another?

: I myself an an engineer with a Catholic background, so I like to see things rationally within the borders defined by Christianity, Ethics and Aesthetics. This does not mean that I scorn all other forms and suggestions of the supernatural. I grew up in Berkshire, UK, within the aura of the White Horse and other prehistoric monuments, and must admit these have always had a fascination and attraction for me.

: What I like about the religious side of Tolkien's mythology, is that it reconciles Pagan (polytheistic) with Christian (monotheistic) views of the universe. I have always felt both have a validity of their own.

: I would be especially interested to know how people from different religious or atheist backgrounds feel about this, and with what they can identify. I was fascinated to hear there are Tolkien fan groups in Japan and Korea. None of them will probably read this, but I wonder how thaey identify with Tolkien.

More often than not, magic is used a literary device. Tolkein's does not over-power the story, nor are its workings explained.It simply exists as part of Middle Earth.

Today's science is the supernatural and the magic of yesterday. At least that's how I look at it. Multi-colored lights move thru the night sky. A roaring sound fills our ears. We know its an airplane. In older times, to those who saw it, it would be aliens from Mars, an angel or demon, or a dragon. A majority of today's people have some knowlege of how an airplane works. In older times, the plane can fly only because those inside belive in the "magic" that keeps it in the air.

I see the religious aspects and magic in Middle Earth as linked. The majority of magic in Middle Earth is practiced by gods and lessor gods. Yes, there are those who have gained, or been taught, the craft of putting magic into an item. However, unless the god or lessor god has a direct hand, the magic is never as strong.

The religious aspects of Middle Earth intrigue me. We are told the mythos, but are not told how any religion is practiced or how it applies to the practioner's daily life. In the case of Hobbits, we have little or no idea of their religious beliefs, if any. Religon in Middle Earth is like magic. It exist, but is not clearly defined. This I believe was Tolkien's intention with both.

As a mechanical designer, my task was making the engineer's vision reality. This often requires a mix of both rationality and imagination.~Aelmer