The White Council

Re: Middle Earth 'Baby Boom'??

Tolkien and Inklings Discussion

: : : : : My take on it is that the only race that would really increase is men. I think the elves would continue to dwindle and depart. I think the hobbits for a while would also continue to increase but I think that there would come a time that this would stop. I imagine their future would be one of increasingly separating themselves from the other races and they too would dwindle. Same scenerio for the dwarves. As the Fourth Age is the beginning of the time of man I think that it is there that any long lasting population increase would happen. Besides, I've never seen an elf and it's been years since I last saw a hobbit or a dwarf.

: : : : Yes, but there is an awfully long time for this dominion of men to come about, I am looking at the first few centuries of the new age when the other races were still at large, at this time could there have been a 'baby boom'? : : : : Don Q

: : : I guess there could have been, but there is no reason to necessarily believe there would be. The baby boom that occurred after WWII was fairly unique, and was a combination of many factors. There was no similar boom after WWI for instance, though no doubt the influenze pandemic eliminated any chance of that happening. Anyway I don't think the Elvish population would have increased. Probably most Elves left and the rest just kind of waited out their days. Dwarves never reproduced quickly, even in the best of circumstances. Hobbits probably did, but there were never that many Hobbits anyway. That leaves Men, and since Gondor was underpopulated it would have taken them a while too. But within a couple hundred years I think there would be a noticeable increase in the human population. I wonder about orcs, they always reproduced quickly...

: : Well not necessarily re the Elves - remember, the Silvan Elves were very happy in their home in Mirkwood, and the fact that Legolas was able to lead a large protion of its people to Ithillien indicates to me a substantial population, on the increase. I'm not suggesting this was a lasting trait as they would in small groups look to go over sea in time, but the same would apply to the elves of Lorien for a time too (East Lorien), and the population of Lindon would be held steady for a time by Elves arriving and preparing to emigrate offsetting those leaving. So for a time (say 5 to 600 years or maybe a little longer, not more than a thousand) you have a slight increase in ELvish population or at least a very slow decline, until 'saturation' point of mankind's dominance when the elvish kingdoms dwindle away to leave a wandering, dwindling and secret folk that became the elves of European legend...... : : Don Q

: You make it sound like we live in the same world just thousands of years later. : -Thentaran

Well that was what Tolkein was trying to portray, an alternative pre-history for this planet, therefore it makes sense to me to speculate on things he didn't write about using this world as a guide and our own history, otherwise anything goes Don Q