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Re: Balrog And Tolkien's Use Of The Word "LIKE"

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  Posted by Goodgulf on July 22, 2000 at 10:51:41
In Reply to: Re: Balrog And Tolkien's Use Of The Word "LIKE" posted by Mordomin on July 22, 2000 at 04:18:11:



: : I tend to agree that Tolkien was "leading the reader" -building the suspense, but I'm not sure I agree with the symbolic or metaphorical view of the Balrog's fall. At any rate, my argument is with those that use the word 'like' to try and prove that the word 'wings' refers back to a metaphorical description, but ignore the same usage when referring to the shadow itself. Either the shadow and the wings are both metaphorical or they are both real. The evidence supports that something real was there -that goes without saying. The Balrog was obviously real. But Tolkien also describes the Balrog as a shadow (the shadow fell), so if the shadow is a metaphor, then the Balrog itself is a metaphor - a concept I reject. So if the shadow is NOT a metaphor, then neither are the wings.

: : I firmly believe that the wings were real, not metaphorical. Whether or not the Balrog could fly (perhaps there wasn't enough room, or the wings were just for show), I do not know.

: I agree with Martin's post, too, in fact I say much the same thing in my own post, but Martin says it better (damn you Martin, LOL).

: As for whether a Balrog could fly or not, I offer this bit of evidence: When Legolas shoots down the Winged Nazgul over Anduin, they cannot see it and do not know what it is. They discuss what it might have been, and 'a Balrog' is one of the suggested possibilities. While Frodo discounts this by saying "no, something colder", nobody says "don't be stupid, it couldn't be a balrog, balrogs don't fly".

: I admit that that is weak, but it is suggestive. :)

I don't think that it is weak at all. It's got a couple things going for it. For one, it's a quote from the LOTR, so no one can argue that it was an old idea that Tolkien dropped. And it suggests that they thought that Balrogs could fly. But it doesn't tell us if Balrogs had wings, unless Legolas was able to see them - and I think he did, but I won't swear to it.

A question: Which was more powerful, the Ringwraiths or the Balrog?


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