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Would Frodo and Bilbo turned into something like Gollum?

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  • Would Frodo and Bilbo turned into something like Gollum?
• Would Frodo and Bilbo turned into something like Gollum?

• Would Frodo and Bilbo turned into something like Gollum?

  badlands > November 5th, 2023, 12:27 AM

  Was it possible?

• RE: Would Frodo and Bilbo turned into something like Gollum?

  ZehnWaters > November 5th, 2023, 01:33 AM

  Yes. It would have been slower as Frodo and Bilbo started their journey with compassion and with good motives.

• RE: Would Frodo and Bilbo turned into something like Gollum?

  Michael > November 6th, 2023, 02:57 AM

  Yes. If Bilbo or Frodo had kept the One Ring as long as Gollum - in a similar manner (not really using it but hiding it), they probably would have become corrupted and physically changed in some ways. But maybe not exactly like Gollum.

• RE: Would Frodo and Bilbo turned into something like Gollum?

  ZehnWaters > November 6th, 2023, 12:40 PM

  (November 6th, 2023, 02:57 AM)Michael Wrote: Yes. If Bilbo or Frodo had kept the One Ring as long as Gollum - in a similar manner (not really using it but hiding it), they probably would have become corrupted and physically changed in some ways. But maybe not exactly like Gollum.

  
  True, they were very different in nature from Gollum.  Gollum was a simple river-dweller whereas Bilbo and Frodo were hobbit gentry.  Corrupted in a similar fashion but different in form.  It's an interesting thought experiment to wonder what they would look like and HOW they would become corrupted.

• RE: Would Frodo and Bilbo turned into something like Gollum?

  Mordomin > November 9th, 2023, 03:00 AM

  (November 6th, 2023, 12:40 PM)ZehnWaters Wrote:

  (November 6th, 2023, 02:57 AM)Michael Wrote: Yes. If Bilbo or Frodo had kept the One Ring as long as Gollum - in a similar manner (not really using it but hiding it), they probably would have become corrupted and physically changed in some ways. But maybe not exactly like Gollum.

  
  True, they were very different in nature from Gollum.  Gollum was a simple river-dweller whereas Bilbo and Frodo were hobbit gentry.  Corrupted in a similar fashion but different in form.  It's an interesting thought experiment to wonder what they would look like and HOW they would become corrupted.

  I think that a crucial difference between Smeagol and Bilbo is that the former came into possession of the Ring through greed and murder, whereas Bilbo came by it through happenstance (despite Smeagol's claims of theft) and one of Bilbo's first acts while wearing the Ring was to show pity - to Gollum.

• RE: Would Frodo and Bilbo turned into something like Gollum?

  Alvin Eriol > November 9th, 2023, 01:22 PM

  (November 9th, 2023, 03:00 AM)Mordomin Wrote: I think that a crucial difference between Smeagol and Bilbo is that the former came into possession of the Ring through greed and murder, whereas Bilbo came by it through happenstance (despite Smeagol's claims of theft) and one of Bilbo's first acts while wearing the Ring was to show pity - to Gollum.

  
  Yup. And according to Gandalf (and JRRT in a Letter or 2), Bilbo's Pity made the crucial difference in several ways, including the relatively weak hold It ever developed on him.
  
  However, by the time of his infamous Birthday-Party, he reported feeling "stretched", a sign Gandalf said was the Ring was gaining power over him as he aged beyond Hobbit lifespan norms. Had he continued to keep it, he would have slowly transformed in some fashion, maybe not as obviously as either Gollum or the Wraiths at 1st. Maybe he, rather than Lotho and his mom, would have become the would-be tyrant of the Shire, for his fellow Hobbits' own good of course, and invited in ruffians to enforce his will. of course by that time Sauron or maybe Saruman would have ID'd him and surmised he had the Ring!

• RE: Would Frodo and Bilbo turned into something like Gollum?

  badlands > November 9th, 2023, 05:28 PM

  https://movieweb.com/lord-rings-dark-art...-one-ring/
  
  This is what they might have looked like if they had been corrupted.

• RE: Would Frodo and Bilbo turned into something like Gollum?

  ZehnWaters > November 10th, 2023, 03:24 PM

  (November 9th, 2023, 05:28 PM)badlands Wrote: https://movieweb.com/lord-rings-dark-art...-one-ring/
  
  This is what they might have looked like if they had been corrupted.

  
  That's fun in a dark sorta way.

• RE: Would Frodo and Bilbo turned into something like Gollum?

  turnipjuice > November 10th, 2023, 04:58 PM

  Another influence on Gollum's physical appearance was that he ran away and hid beneath the Misty Mountains.  That type of environment would surely leave a lasting impact on anyone.  No sunlight.  Nothing really green to eat like vegetables or fruit.  Dark surroundings and unforgiving terrain.  Just slimy fish and the occasional goblin to munch on.

• RE: Would Frodo and Bilbo turned into something like Gollum?

  gzhindra > November 11th, 2023, 06:48 AM

  At Rivendell Bilbo asks Frodo to see the ring. Frodo sees a quick vision of Bilbo "little wrinkled creature with a hungry face and bony groping hands".
  Perhaps that what Bilbo would look like if he kept the ring?

• RE: Would Frodo and Bilbo turned into something like Gollum?

  Michael > November 11th, 2023, 12:50 PM

  That's an interesting scene, because obviously the Ring was influencing what Frodo perceived. But it's not clear how accurate the depiction would be as foreshadowing. And foreshadowing is a common motif throughout the book. So I don't think it's fair to dismiss the scene as the Ring simply messing with Frodo's mind.
  
  That's probably why Peter Jackson's take on the scene (and later Galadriel's temptation) was so literal. Peter has read all the books and he included details about the story that many of his critics seem to be unaware of. Even the scene in the second film where Arwen magically "appears" so she can help Aragorn is inspired by something Tolkien actually wrote (in "The Tale of Aragorn and Arwen").

• RE: Would Frodo and Bilbo turned into something like Gollum?

  gzhindra > November 12th, 2023, 05:43 PM

  At one point Gollum looked like a normal hobbit but he then turned into Gollum.
  It seems then that the vision of Bilbo's future is probably somewhat accurate.
  
  It's interesting that the ring did not want to be returned to Bilbo.

• RE: Would Frodo and Bilbo turned into something like Gollum?

  ZehnWaters > November 13th, 2023, 12:28 PM

  (November 11th, 2023, 12:50 PM)Michael Wrote: That's an interesting scene, because obviously the Ring was influencing what Frodo perceived. But it's not clear how accurate the depiction would be as foreshadowing. And foreshadowing is a common motif throughout the book. So I don't think it's fair to dismiss the scene as the Ring simply messing with Frodo's mind.
  
  That's probably why Peter Jackson's take on the scene (and later Galadriel's temptation) was so literal. Peter has read all the books and he included details about the story that many of his critics seem to be unaware of. Even the scene in the second film where Arwen magically "appears" so she can help Aragorn is inspired by something Tolkien actually wrote (in "The Tale of Aragorn and Arwen").

  
  It's hard to portray such elements as those in live-action.  I thought he did a decent job.  There are certainly more robust criticisms to make of PJ.
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